27 thoughts on “Trial News”

  1. Little is left to determine, really, except for who instigated the fight.

    If the jury decides it was Trayvon, Zim acted in self defense.
    If it was Zim, then at minimum it was manslaughter, and depending on circumstances (which I’m not sure have been proven) possibly 2nd degree murder.

    But I am no lawyer or judge, nor on the jury.

  2. I’d heard the same thing that Meteor Blades wrote about.

    If he gets manslaughter, that’ll at least be something. I just don’t want him to walk, because he doesn’t deserve to. He needs to do some serious time.

  3. If a manslaughter charge would get Zimmermann convicted then that’s fine with me. I just don’t want to see him walk away unscathed. His actions resulted in the death of an innocent kid, and society needs to hold him accountable.
    As far as I’m concerned Zimmermann is just a place hold.. He’s a nobody. What I want to see is the mentality of the gun toting concealed carry dispensers of righteousness punished. That’s the scourge that’s been unleashed on the American public with the Stand Your Ground laws.
    We’ve always had the protection of law to defend ourselves, but the SYG laws in conjunction with the concealed carry laws have made it possible for the emotionally insecure to wreak havoc on public safety.

  4. the SYG laws in conjunction with the concealed carry laws have made it possible for the emotionally insecure to wreak havoc on public safety

    Amen, tell it brother!

  5. He went against 911 operator advice when he went after Martin. That is ALL a THOUGHTFUL juror should need to convict. That said, manslaughter would be OK, in my view. “Walking” would not- Zimmerman has really come across as a truly vile individual as we have learned more about him– vile and scary. And pleading “not guilty”? Give me a break!

  6. I’m no expert on the American legal system, but actually, I always thought that Zimmerman should be charged with manslaughter, and I’m surprised to learn he was even being charged with anything else. My understanding of “murder” is that the killer had intent to kill, or planned it (first-degree). I don’t think Zimmerman planned anything, and probably didn’t even intend to kill when he pulled the trigger. But nevertheless, Zimmerman did instigate the confrontation which resulted in him killing Trayon Martin, so I can’t quite buy the argument that it was “self-defense” even if Martin struck the first blow. Seems to me that a manslaughter conviction would best serve justice in this case.

    If Zimmerman simply walks free, I wonder if it will trigger rioting, as happened in the Rodney King case some years back. If you live in an American inner city, perhaps this would be a good time to take a vacation.

    • Paraquat — He was charged with second-degree murder, which doesn’t require proving that he had a prior intention to murder anyone.

  7. If Zimmerman simply walks free, I wonder if it will trigger rioting, as happened in the Rodney King case some years back. If you live in an American inner city, perhaps this would be a good time to take a vacation.

    Yeah you know them niggras they all act the same, racist much?

  9. …should have added before I hit the submit button:

    “Yeah you know them niggras they all act the same”

    your words, not mine. Only one here using the “N” word here is you.

  10. Paraquat.. I’ve got a nephew who is a Pinellas County policeman (St. Petersburg – Long history of racial tensions and rioting) and they have been put on alert to be prepared for riots if Zimmerman is acquitted. But my recollections of racial rioting resulting from legal decisions always seemed to involve police injustice directed against the black community where there is no accountability to justice,
    The fact that Zimmermann was charged and given a fair and open trial will shift the burden of accountability for justice to a jury, so I doubt there will be rioting. There might be a lot of pissed off people if Zimmermann walks, but faith in the fairness of the southern jury system has progressed since the days of Jim Crow.
    Look at Casey Anthony’s trial…Even though everybody knew that she was guilty, the jury remained true to their obligation to justice. The state failed to “prove” that she killed her child.

  11. Hi Swami,

    I hope you are right. I hope there are no riots. But emotions are running very high. If Zimmerman walks, who knows what will happen? Of course, if he’s found guilty of manslaughter, the only ones who might riot would be the Tea Party folks. I could just picture Rush Limbaugh egging them on, and then saying “Hey, I was only kidding, I’m just an entertainer.”

    As for the jury angle, as I recall, in the Rodney King case, the officers were acquitted of brutality and assault charges by a jury, not a judge.

    Anyway, here’s to hoping for a positive outcome.

    – P.

    • Paraquat — It is racist to assume widespread “inner city” rioting in case of an acquittal, and not also consider rioting by white wingnuts in case of a conviction.

      Either way, I wouldn’t be surprised of some isolated incidents of violence, but there will be no rioting.

  12. The more I think about it, the more I wonder if it’s fair to suggest Zimmerman has the mental capacity to murder. Did he ever view Trayvon as a human being that he was going to kill, or merely as some subhuman pest, a ‘thug’, or an n-word, or some other imaginary creature that he, in his own personal movie, was going to ‘defend’ his neighborhood from, as if he were some descendant of a knight keeping the kingdom safe from dragons.

    I don’t understand why the prosecution didn’t spend more time establishing a ‘reasonable behavior’ standard, articulating what we, as citizens, have a right to expect a ‘normal’ or ‘reasonable’ person to do in such situations. To my mind, a ‘reasonable’ person, having reported his sighting of a suspicious person to the police, gets in his car and drives way, and if he goes chasing the stranger down with a gun, he’s provoked whatever happens after that. But that’s not the movie script that Zimmerman’s ego had cast him in that night. He was out to take down a black ‘punk’, looking for trouble and succeeded in creating it.

  13. The assumption that “those people” will riot is deeply insulting. Personally, I wanted to riot when I heard that a boy was shot without it resulting in an arrest.

  14. Whatever you think about Paraquat’s statement, he didn’t use the term “those people”.

  15. “Uncledad, accusing me of racism. You are way out of line”

    When you assume there will be violence, just like “Rodney King” and in the “inner city” what am I to assume? It is offensive to suggest a particular demographic will act to riot; your assumption is based solely on race isn’t it? You don’t have to use the N word to come across as racist.

  16. Well you have to acknowledge a racial aspect even though it remains unspoken. “They always get away” is up for interpretation.

    Years ago when I bought my first house I was being taxied around by a real estate agent to look at houses. After looking at one house the agent drove me and my girlfriend( now wife) around the neighborhood for us to get a sense of the neighborhood in which it was located. After riding in silence for several minutes the agent said to me,” I don’t see any”. There was never any mention or indication on my part that I had a concern about “any”. It was a totally unsolicited comment, but I knew full well what he meant. I was attuned to code talking.. My wife asked me later what he was talking about with that comment.. I told her that he was talking about rose bushes.. He didn’t see any rose bushes.
    My point is that racial tensions are out there in the Zimmerman case and while we don’t want to exacerbate them, we can’t not acknowledge them either.

  17. “My point is that racial tensions are out there in the Zimmerman case and while we don’t want to exacerbate them, we can’t not acknowledge them either”

    I agree. I was simply pointing out that when one assumes there will be riots based on race ( I wonder if it will trigger rioting, as happened in the Rodney King case some years back. If you live in an American inner city, perhaps this would be a good time to take a vacation), then that suggestion comes across as racist to me?

  18. uncledad.. Paraquat didn’t assume, he wondered. From my perspective you appeared a little too quick to assign a racist label to him.
    It’s difficult to communicate in the medium of internet commenting. We are deprived of many communication skills, tone, inflection, body language, facial expression and many other subtle devices that aid in effective communication. So it’s easy to be misunderstood if we don’t articulate exactly what we’re trying to communicate.
    I know in my case that if people understood exactly what a wonderful guy, so loveable and full of charm that I am ,I wouldn’t have the need to be so exacting in what I say. I don’t have the luxury of employing my impish grin when I’m called out for bullshitting, or rolling my eyes to other commenters when I catch someone in the act of bullshitting.
    You know what I’m saying…We’re all at a disadvantage in communicating exactly what we intend to say and sometimes we are perceived as saying things we didn’t intend to say.
    So in that spirit…How about we all join together in a …..
    ((((((((((((((((((( GROUP HUG)))))))))))))))))

    PS. Swami is all about love! (really)

  21. Getting back to Zimmerman…If he is convicted he won’t be getting his morning donut any more.. He looks to have put on a couple of pounds since he been holed up where ever he’s been hiding.
    He looks pretty sharp in the new suits that his supporters purchased for him. I wouldn’t mind owning a few them those suits myself.. I liked the salt and pepper one with the violet tie, tied with a broad Windsor knot. His haberdasher seems to have it going on. But when he stood up to address the court in waiving his right to testify I noticed that the bottom button on his shirt had popped and his spare tire was very pronounced.
    I would have figured that he would have hit the sit-up trail while he was laying low just to make a more presentable appearance before a jury. His outfits were all sharp and nicely coordinated, but he is a little rotund, and that could translate in the minds of a jury into an attitude of contentment.
    I know if that were me I’d want to be gaunt to give the jury the impression that I was very much concerned about the situation I found myself in.

  22. He looks to have put on a couple of pounds since he been holed up where ever he’s been hiding…. But when he stood up to address the court in waiving his right to testify I noticed that the bottom button on his shirt had popped and his spare tire was very pronounced…. I know if that were me I’d want to be gaunt to give the jury the impression that I was very much concerned about the situation I found myself in.

    Now I can’t decide if I’m sorry or relieved that I don’t have teevee access all day; Swami’s description is alternately hilarious, sad, a tad nauseating, and quite insightful. I got more from that comment than 10,000 words from The New Yorker’s Brainy Law Dood, Jeffrey Toobin.

  23. A liberal polity prefers certain punishments, even if mild, over uncertain harsh punishments. So a manslaughter conviction for Zimmerman will do. Maybe it’ll have to do.

    If they pursued a charge of 3rd degree murder (“the unlawful killing of another human being without justification or excuse”) then they wouldn’t need to prove intent.

  24. “From my perspective you appeared a little too quick to assign a racist label to him”

    Once again I am forced to agree, just a little quick maybe I should have waited another ten minutes. I would retract the Racist label, had the comments been explained, but they have not been. And besides Maha has already ruled: “Paraquat — It is racist to assume widespread “inner city” rioting in case of an acquittal, and not also consider rioting by white wingnuts in case of a conviction”

    Also there was this:

    “If you live in an American inner city, perhaps this would be a good time to take a vacation”

    What does that mean? I read it as if you live near some colored folk they liable to get crazy and it best you gets away for the weekend? If it means something else I’d like to hear it.

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